The Rosie and Roula Show

Marriage: Romance or Requirement?

• Roula Abou Haidar and Rosie Burrows

Share episode

Do You Have to Get Married? Perspectives on Love and Life

Marriage: tradition, contract, romance, or societal expectation? In this eye-opening episode, Rosie (single) and Roula (married twice) dive into what marriage really means—and whether it has to define your life.

From cultural pressures to practical realities, Roula shares her experiences navigating two marriages, divorce, and raising children, while Rosie questions the very concept of “tying the knot.” Together, they explore how love, commitment, and freedom intersect in ways that aren’t always obvious.

In this candid, hilarious, and thought-provoking episode, you’ll hear about:

  • Why marriage can be more practical than romantic
  • How cultural expectations shape our decisions about love and partnership
  • Divorce, legal contracts, and the real-life logistics behind “forever”
  • Challenging societal norms around being single or married
  • Finding freedom and fulfillment without following the traditional script

💡 Holiday takeaway: Whether you’re married, divorced, or blissfully single, the key is doing life on your terms. Celebrate relationships—or solo adventures—without guilt, pressure, or judgment.

--------------------

--------------------

--------------------

[00:00:00] Welcome to the Rosie Show. Marba. Good day.

ROSIE: oh all right Roula this is great because i'm single And you're married and I want to talk about marriage.

ROSIE: Are you ready? I've had a lot of experience cause I'm divorced and 

Roula: remarried. 

ROSIE: This is perfect then. I've had no experience and you've, you've done it twice over. So this is good. I used to think that I wanted to get married.

ROSIE: Okay. Used to think I wanted to get married, but as I get older, I go, why? You think about like, what does marriage even mean? I'm so confused. It's a contract. And you are saying. I'm going to be [00:01:00] contractually bound to this person for life. I'm going to sign on the dotted line and if for whatever reason I don't want to be with them, I'm breaking the law.

ROSIE: Like I can't do that. It's almost like you're giving unconditional consent and I have issue with that. I just find it whack. I don't get it. However, I'm a very open minded person. So tell me, why have you chosen to get married twice? And do you regret it? Maybe that's too personal. Why have you got married to make 

Roula: this episode light?

Roula: No, no, we had already fun episodes. We can get into something, something like this. Um, all right. So the first time I got married, because in my culture, you can't go and live with someone without being married. And when I met my ex, he's in the Netherlands. I'm in Lebanon. He cannot come to Lebanon because I, he won't have a permit to work [00:02:00] and I cannot come to the Netherlands without being married because then this will mean it's the end of my relationship with my family.

Roula: Wow. Yeah. Um, this is why I got married because it was the right thing to do. This is, this is how it's supposed to be. I found the man that I love that I want to live with. And that's the solution. Get married. Wow. 

ROSIE: And then that didn't work out, did it? 

Roula: It didn't work out and it doesn't have to do anything with the contract with the marriage.

Roula: It didn't work out because we did not grow together in the right way. But the contract of marriage made it so hard to focus on getting married. leaving each other, building a life separately, because it took so much time to get the divorce to, and it's good. It's regulated, especially when you have children or you have [00:03:00] properties together.

Roula: So this contract is important. There is another option. It doesn't have to be a marriage. It can be, um, a life contract together just for economical and financial reason. Um, in the Netherlands, when, when a woman has children, they're all hers unless the father registered that he's officially their father.

Roula: And there's a, we say, which is saying if they don't fill in these forms, the kids are for the woman. 

ROSIE: Wow. Okay. I don't think it's the same here. Yeah. Wow. Okay. 

Roula: So this contract of marriage can arrange things. The problem is when people leave each other in, in problematic, in, in big drama, it becomes like a, like a rope around the neck.

Roula: Yeah. [00:04:00] And if you ask me after I got divorced, I was like, I'm not gonna marry again. That was such hassle to just finish this divorce. And why did I do it? And if you ask me, I don't believe that this marriage paper, will keep us together. It's really only for practical matters. It doesn't, you can have a marriage party and wedding, et cetera, but you don't have to have the paper.

Roula: It doesn't matter. We don't think about that. In my culture, Lebanese culture, I used to worry if I keep living in Lebanon and I'm not planning to marry any Lebanese guy because I don't think their mentality fits me. I was worried, like I can never be. Because everybody will think that I'm just sleeping around and, you know, I would have a bad reputation because I'm not married.

Roula: Either they will make me like, I'm so, like, zielig, the word in Dutch, zielig, [00:05:00] uh, pathetic, that I don't have a man, or I'm a whore, that I have a lot of men and I'm not married. I worried about that very much because I knew I might not marry in Lebanon. Anyway, getting back to our topic, why I decided to marry the second time.

Roula: Um, the second time, my husband and I, we knew this is a contract. We're not married because we want to stay together forever. That was 

ROSIE: my next question. People think marriage is a very romantic thing. I disagree. It's still a romance. Right. But continue you, you, you and your husband knew that it's a, it's a contract.

ROSIE: It was COVID 

Roula: and everybody was scared of dying in COVID time. Yeah. So we thought, you know what, let's go to the city hall, arrange this marriage because we have three kids and we [00:06:00] don't have, we don't have anything on paper. The other way could have been, we go to the notary and we just write our wills.

Roula: That's also possible. It doesn't have to be a marriage. Right, right. Um, but we were on, yeah, we were in a place where we're like, yeah, let's do it as a marriage. And we got married. So it was a, it was a practical thing. Practical. But in both situation, I feel that I, that's so nice actually, in a way that my partners, my male partners, I don't have female partners, but just people, you know, my husbands, my ex and my actual husband, they took it seriously.

Roula: They wanted it. Because we ask women, do you want to marry? But men also have an opinion on that. What about the men? 

ROSIE: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This is true. I like your view on marriage. I really dislike the popular opinion that if you love somebody, the next step is marriage. Like, and it's [00:07:00] the man's responsibility.

ROSIE: Yeah. If you like it, then you should have put a ring on it. Um, yeah, you can take that out. Um, Where, what was I saying? Yeah. It's on the man to propose. And if they've been together with a woman for a couple of years and they haven't proposed, they get all, they cop a lot of flack. It's like, well, come on.

ROSIE: And then there's these shows. There's a show called the ultimatum. It's a reality show and people bring their partners on and it's like, you either propose to me and we get married or we are over. And I think really like

ROSIE: Roula. If your husband. said, no, I don't want to get married. Would you have left? Well, he asked me. 

Roula: True. Uh, no, no, as long as, as long as things are arranged, whether with the [00:08:00] notary, that our kids are, have the know what to do. Yes. And it's not only about being separated. We could be going to a party in the car and have a car accident.

Roula: Right, right. You know? Yeah. So, there are practical things we don't like to think about, but we should. And again, it could be at the notary. It doesn't have to be a marriage. And if people want a marriage for the party, it's good to have a, I mean, we got married, but we don't have a party. And our kids, they're so like, they want us to have a party.

Roula: Oh. No. Um, yeah, it's, it should be, um, pressure free. But the cultures we live in, they determine how to do things. And we cannot tell people not to get married if they are in a culture the only way to live together in the same house is to get married. 

ROSIE: Yeah. That's also. [00:09:00] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's hard. That's really hard.

ROSIE: Oh, we're lucky to say this, Rosie, 

Roula: because you live in Australia, I'm in the Netherlands, and it's different from people in Lebanon. They can't even divorce if things go really, really bad between them. Um, and people think divorce is a bad thing, which is not. No, exactly. In so many ways. In many ways, it is a bad thing.

Roula: Another topic. Yup. Am I making people feel like, what the heck? Does she want a marriage? Does she want a divorce? I'm confusing them. I'm confusing people. No, I 

ROSIE: love your point of view. And I, oh, I could just have such an in depth episode on this. Maybe I need to bring you on my podcast because, holy dooly, I think it's a big part of freedom.

ROSIE: Because marriage is like this rite of passage. I've had people ask me, oh, you know, you're going to find another partner, you [00:10:00] know, settle down, get married. Why, why, at the moment, no, maybe in the future, but it's not a priority for me right now. And is there's nothing wrong with that. 

Roula: It's there's nothing wrong with that because we make people who haven't found a partner who don't want a partner, we make them feel like they're pathetic alone, while they might be having the life we want.

Roula: Life that we married people want? 

ROSIE: Yeah. Just jealous, jealous bitches. Yeah. Oh, well this was a more deep episode, but I think it was really important to talk about. So thank you for like sharing all, it was really eyeopening for me. I like your view on marriage. We can stay friends. 

Roula: Okay. Let's see if our listeners like my view on marriage.

ROSIE: Oh God, we could get a lot of unsubscribes. Oh dear. 

Roula: Well, you know, it's a, [00:11:00] it's a podcast for opinionated people and also podcast for people who like to listen to different perspectives. We're not telling anyone to follow what we're saying. On the contrary, their opinion is important to us. so much. Totally.

Roula: This is the bottom line of the podcast. so much, Rosie. 

ROSIE: We're gonna get married and well. We're having such lovely questions. I've forgotten the words. Oh, you're welcome. Bye, everybody. Let us 

Roula: know your thoughts. Bye bye. I 

ROSIE: don't know who's worse at 

Roula: singing, me or you. Bye.