The Rosie and Roula Show

152: Parenting doesn’t always “come naturally" And That’s Okay

• Roula Abou Haidar and Rosie Burrows

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Parenting advice often comes wrapped in comforting phrases like “Don’t worry, it will come naturally.” But what if that’s not true? In this episode, Rosie and Roula get real about the raw, unspoken realities of motherhood, fatherhood, and societal expectations. From sleepless nights and painful breastfeeding to cultural pressures and postpartum depression, Roula shares why parenting is far from “natural” for many—and why that’s okay. 

Whether you’re an expecting parent, a new mom or dad, or simply curious about the myths around parenting, this conversation challenges stereotypes and brings compassion to the chaos of raising children. 

Also Checkout Ep. 24: The Big Question - Do You Want to Have Kids?

Keywords for SEO: parenting doesn’t come naturally, new parent struggles, motherhood truth, postpartum depression, parenting myths, societal expectations, motherhood pressures, parenting support, honest parenting podcast, real talk about parenting 

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Rosie (00:00)
Roula We were talking about parenting last episode and you said something that made me go, whoa, that goes against what most people say. You said parenting does not come naturally. Fuck that. Something to that effect.

Whereas I usually hear people tell, ⁓ expecting parents, don't stress. It's going to come naturally. It will come naturally. Were you told that?

Roula (00:42)
Rosie.

No one ever ever talked to me about this. What parenting means. Is it hard? Is it easy? Is it does it come natural? No one. No one talks about this. And there are a few reasons why I can't probably think of all of them now. The most strong reason I have is that women are expected to have a natural motherly instinct and know what to do.

Rosie (01:13)
true.

Roula (01:14)
just because they're mothers.

Rosie (01:16)
Mmm.

Roula (01:19)
And mothers-to-be or girls, women who want to become mothers will feel less of a mom if they say, I don't know what to do. I have no idea how to cope once the baby is here.

Because when moms would say, don't know how to cope, it would look like she's incompetent. She's not worthy to be a mom. And the truth is, the moment we hold these babies in our arms, yes, love is overflowing. And we think everything will be all right because we have so much love for them. But love does not raise a baby.

Rosie (01:58)
Hmm.

Yeah.

Roula (02:08)
the long wake nights, the painful nursing, the boobs that are hurting because breastfeeding is not working, the moment when the baby is born, the mom, she might have had some stitches, she can't even sit. All her body is aching. Sleepless nights, her adrenaline is high, her fears are so big.

Rosie (02:31)
Hmm.

Roula (02:38)
Tell me what's natural. It is natural about that. But how can you have to be present and care for a baby while you are feeling devastated? But you don't say a word because it comes with it.

Rosie (02:52)
Wow. ⁓

Roula (02:58)
And yes, it doesn't come natural because to give you an example, I don't know how it happens in other countries, but something very good happens in the Netherlands. When we give birth, there's a nurse that come and stay with us for eight days. She teaches us how to, yeah, how to clean the diaper, how to feed.

Rosie (03:18)
Whoa.

Roula (03:25)
how to help us with the problem with nursing, to teach the dad how to prepare a bottle of milk and give it, how to help the baby fall asleep, have conversations about what to do in certain situations. And before people are having a baby, no one talks about this. Because you know, some things we don't talk about them, because if we do, we never want to have them or do them, because they're scary.

Rosie (03:53)
Sure.

Roula (03:57)
And when I say it doesn't come natural, I'm not generalizing. There are women, like I know my sister, it's like she's born to be a mom.

Rosie (04:07)
Hmm.

Roula (04:08)
And there are women like me who are not born to be mothers. Mother is part of our life, but it's not our existence. And this is where I say it doesn't come natural to everyone.

Rosie (04:23)
Hmm.

Roula (04:24)
it's hard. And then you have the father. The father needs to connect with the baby. Their love needs, yes there is an immediate love, but the relationship needs to grow because there are also fathers that they feel if they hold their baby they're gonna break them because they're so tiny and so fragile. And we have to learn this. And if parenting comes natural,

Rosie (04:43)
Hmmmm

Roula (04:51)
We would be screwing up as parents over and over again. We would be doing a great job.

Rosie (04:53)
Well, true. Yes. Good point.

True. And I think there's a lot of shame when mothers in particular, I think, feel like they're incompetent. They don't know what they're doing. They're not good at it. It's not coming naturally. I think there's shame associated with that.

Roula (05:20)
If you let your child cry, you're a bad mom. If you let your child cry because you think they have to cry a little bit, it's needed, whatever, then you have so many opinions. You should do it like this and you should do it like that. And everybody have to tell you how to do things when you're a mom, because every mom thinks she does it better. And sorry, moms. Yes, you do. Each mom thinks I'm also

think I do things better. 100%. When I see my nephews and the interaction, there are so many things I have an opinion about, but I don't say them because I'm now at a stage that I better shut my mouth because it's not for me to say anything. But really, mothers becoming a mother is natural, but psychologically and mentally,

is draining and no wonder we have postpartum depression after giving birth no one talks about that because you should be happy you just have a baby ⁓ my god i have a baby my whole life is gone now ⁓ but you

Rosie (06:20)
Mmm.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, you'd be grieving the life that you had. Everything's

changed.

Roula (06:43)
But then they tell you, you chose to become a mom. Well, a of women don't choose to become a mom. They have to because these are the expectations to have them as complete. And in our modern society, yes, we become a mom. We're so happy, but we still have a household. We still have a job to keep up to. We have still have finances to be able to maintain our sanity. No, it doesn't come natural. It comes with.

with lot of hard work and yeah, learning, it's learning on the job. Mothering, parenting is learning on the job.

Rosie (07:21)
And I'm guessing it never ends. Does it ever end? The learning.

Roula (07:27)
no, it never ends. You become wiser to give advice, unsolicited advice.

Rosie (07:32)
Mmm.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'm being

quite quiet in this episode because I could spout all sorts of things, but I think when you don't have the lived experience of being a parent, how could you possibly know? As an observer, I see it, but I will never know what that's like without actually being a parent myself.

So it's nice to hear. ⁓

Roula (08:01)
We have recorded a few episodes that

tie into this. We have an episode about not wanting children.

Rosie (08:09)
Yes, we do.

Roula (08:11)
choice of not wanting children. And I feel like we have another episode where we talked about how women feel about the societal expectations. We will link them in the show notes. But yeah, it's, it's, it's tough becoming a parent. It's tough. It's beautiful.

Rosie (08:23)
Yes.

Mm.

Roula (08:35)
It could be, but it also could be devastating. No one knows.

Rosie (08:40)
You know what I love about you Rula? You keep it real. There's no sugar coating it. It's just, this is how it is. And I think that's really important. It's important to have conversations, laying it all out. Can't just focus on the good stuff or the negative stuff. It's, hey, I don't know how it's going to look for you, but it's probably going to be really difficult.

It'll hopefully be worth your while. is for a lot of people, but hey, who knows?

Roula (09:17)
No one knows until it happens. And I don't want to leave this on a depressing note, like parenting doesn't come natural. You know, it's continuity. Becoming a parent is we have to continue life and give it the best that we can. Be the best parents. But to become the best parents, first we have to treat ourselves, heal ourselves.

Rosie (09:20)
This is true.

No. Okay. Yes.

Roula (09:46)
be the person we want to be and then become a parent. And this is what I didn't do. And now, OK, I'm biased. People say, yeah, because you didn't do it. Now you speak like this. No. In societies like the Middle Eastern Society and maybe also in South America or in Asia, a woman is expected to become a parent like a year after marriage. And if you don't get pregnant after a year, what's going on? Why aren't you pregnant?

Rosie (09:58)
Ha

Mm.

Mmm.

Roula (10:16)
What's the problem? And of course, it's never it's never a he problem. It's always a she problem. She cannot get pregnant. And yes, there this is the belly that has to carry a baby. And if it's not working, it's her problem for in the eyes of society. But yes, I grew up in a place where the end goal of my existence is to become a mother. And it took me years to understand.

that this is not right and I didn't know how to stand up for myself on this topic because I wanted to please everyone. wanted, yeah, of course I want to be a mom. I mean, I'm a woman. I'm going to be a mom. ⁓ And yeah, like just like me, many other women live in society where that's the end goal of their life.

Rosie (10:50)
Hmm.

Hmm.

I want to go back. You said you think you need to do the work on yourself first before becoming a mother. But my pushback on that is.

Is that not an ongoing journey? Maybe it's more so you've begun that journey and you're committed to continue on that journey.

Roula (11:38)
Yes, Rosie, you are very much right. Yeah.

Rosie (11:42)
Mm. Mm.

Roula (11:44)
It never ends

working on ourselves, it never ends failing, getting up. Have I told you I was crying before we started recording? Because I had no because I had a in myself that is killing me and I'm not able to to let go of it.

Rosie (11:48)
Yeah.

you didn't, no?

Roula (12:03)
and have to work on it. It's an ongoing thing.

Rosie (12:05)
Hmm.

Hmm.

Well, shit. Yep. It is ongoing. my goodness. And this episode, where did this episode start? Parenting not coming naturally. So I think, yeah. What would your take home message be for people listening, maybe expecting parents or new parents? What, if there's one thing they get from this episode, what would it be?

Roula (12:15)
You

Yeah, get mothering. Yes.

You know, Rosie, our listeners are from all over the world. Because we're recording this, I'm in Europe, you're in Australia, it kind of feels that we're speaking to the Western world. But I don't think so, because if I look at our listeners, it's every corner of the world is listening. And I don't really have a takeaway because when we have these conversations, I'm just speaking from the heart in this moment.

Rosie (12:49)
It does, yeah.

Yeah,

yeah.

Roula (13:08)
I don't have anything to say, take away. That's the only true thing that I want to say is, and I say this to my daughters too, fulfill your life, fill in your personal cup. Look at what your true dreams are before you start with the journey of parenting. And it's okay if you're 30 plus. Would they make us scared that when you're above 30, it's hard to get pregnant? Well,

Rosie (13:11)
you

Roula (13:38)
It can happen. You can be 25 and can't get pregnant easily. So that's not a rule. Just let not waste time filling your cup before you consider becoming a parent.

Rosie (13:53)
Hmm, I think that sounds like wise. It sounds like wisdom, wise advice. What I would add is be kind to yourself. Please just be kind to yourself. I think that's one of the most important things. You're doing great. All right, everybody, catch you in the next episode. ⁓